How To Integrate Transformational Tech Opportunities With Traditional Customer Support

Transcript

[00:00:00] Steve MacDonald: Welcome everyone to the Contact Center Perspectives podcast. I’m Steve MacDonald, your host, and we have a very special guest on today, Luke Squires. Now Luke, you are the Customer Experience Director at Sykes Holiday Cottages. You’ve been in the business for over 10 years. You had a really big retail background behind that.

[00:00:19] Steve MacDonald: But what’s interesting, you and I both share what we call our superpowers. We both are diagnosed with ADHD. And what I’d love to do,though that gives us tremendous abilities,there are things we have to look out for and watch for as well. But before we get started, because the topic today is how to integrate the transformational tech opportunities that are happening in AI and everything with traditional customer support, and what are the things that we need to know and look out for, before we do that, I’d love to just turn it over to you and learn a little bit more about your background.

[00:00:53] Luke Squires: Yeah. Thank you so much, Steve, and I’m delighted to be talking to you today. Yeah, I guess as you say, I’m Customer Experience Director here at Sykes Holiday Cottages. I’m really proud to be leading all of our customer and owner teams. We have nearly 16,000 owners now,

[00:01:10] Luke Squires: nearly 23,000 properties that we manage. We’re the UK’s number one holiday rental company. So for me, it’s a very privileged position to be in. As you mentioned, quite a varied background. I love travel, so I was with Virgin Atlantic Holidays, and that was an amazing time for me where I just got an absolute bug for travel, whether that be international or UK.

[00:01:32] Luke Squires: And yeah, like you say, I have ADHD, and I think it gives a very different perspective on the way that I operate and the way I expect others to operate. And it really gets me quite excited.

[00:01:43] Steve MacDonald: Let’s get excited about our topic today. The idea of these transformational tech opportunities. We’ve had a very traditional, for years, approach for how we do customer service, how we work with our agents. And I just love to ask you, what is your overall perspective on what’s happening in the industry? Let’s just start out that way.

[00:02:03] Luke Squires: My overall perspective at the moment is it’s an incredibly exciting time for the call center industry. I think technology is the best it’s ever been. It’s ever-evolving. It’s becoming more accessible for companies. It still has a big cost, but I think, Steve, things like AI are no longer a new concept anymore.

[00:02:23] Luke Squires: And it is something now that businesses can take on and they can start to run with. And I’m certainly getting very excited about watching that develop. And my team will tell you, I’m the first to find something on LinkedIn or find something on the internet and say, “I wanna do that, I wanna put that in.”

[00:02:38] Luke Squires: But it is more accessible than it’s ever been. And indeed, even three years ago, I think we were talking about generative AI and it was coming down the line; we all need to get prepared for it. It’s here now. And it’s proven; it’s a concept that has now been proven.

[00:02:53] Luke Squires: So it’s a dead exciting time for us, but it definitely comes with its challenges that we’ve got to overcome with it.

[00:02:58] Steve MacDonald: Let’s talk about some of those challenges, and I wanna start out and let’s talk about the consumer. All of this is about the end customer that we’re serving better, but the end customer, their preferences are changing quite a bit. The experience that they expect is changing quite a bit.

[00:03:15] Steve MacDonald: Talk to us a little bit about that, and then let’s talk about the technology and the role in that.

[00:03:19] Luke Squires: Yeah. Consumer behavior has changed massively since the pandemic. It’s changing massively in the last six months, and it will in the next year. What I find really interesting is, I guess the pandemic gave a purpose back to contact centers. I think at one point, contact centers were starting to be seen as a cost to a business.

[00:03:39] Luke Squires: I sit here quite proudly going, do you know what? We’re no longer a cost. We’re a vital part of a business’s operation. We are the front people talking to our customers every single day. So there isn’t a biased, there isn’t a part of the business that is so important.

[00:03:54] Luke Squires: But I think consumers have incredibly high expectations. They always have done, but those expectations continue to evolve and change rapidly. One of the things that I have been pushing at pace is, like many, digitalization. It’s automation so that I have the most cost-effective and efficient contact center.

[00:04:13] Luke Squires: That’s important to me because I want consumers to be able to interact with our companies like Sykes Holiday Cottages in a way that is easy for them so that they can complete their query. However, what we’re starting to see is that a new generation is emerging. And a statistic I heard the other day was Generation Z now prefer to talk to people on the phone.

[00:04:33] Luke Squires: We’re starting to see a bit of a loop in that round of going, okay, I guess when we’re all kind of focusing on digital, I think what’s really important as we’re starting to strategize these, we’re looking ahead a little bit more and we’ve got the balance going because I think this generation is saying, “I like interacting on the phone, but I also like doing digital.”

[00:04:51] Luke Squires: How do you make the two seamlessly connect so that experience is great? They’re not just about the consumer who’s here today. We need to start thinking ahead because we’re a perfect industry at reacting. We are now in a place where we have better data and analytics than we’ve ever had.

[00:05:07] Luke Squires: So, we can be a lot more proactive in our approach to it. So yeah, it’s an interesting time and consumers definitely keep us on our feet and keep us employed.

[00:05:15] Steve MacDonald: So, two really important concepts that you brought up there, and I want to dive into each of them. So, the first one was that you talked about cost centers, traditionally, or contact centers, being known as one of the biggest overhead costs in a business. But there’s a direct line to profitability, revenue growth. You mentioned that we’re the frontline with the customers and there’s not a company alive that doesn’t say, “We don’t wanna be customer-focused. We don’t wanna be customer-obsessed.” And so here we’re having all these interactions with them.

[00:06:00] Steve MacDonald: What, in your words, are the most direct impacts that, because we’re having these conversations regularly, we’re the frontline to the customer, how do you articulate the direct impact on the revenue and the growth of the business?

[00:06:04] Luke Squires: Many contact centers run with sales centers. So I have a sales center, so I can put a profit into the operation that we do. And I think historically, that’s what we always focused on in the contact center world: the profit center, and the service element is the cost center.

[00:06:21] Luke Squires: I look at that slightly differently in the sense of the data that we are now able to get within our industry around service queries, around what customers want, around how they interact with us directly, feeds the strategic plans of your business. I know this through my service team: consumers want more flexibility with their bookings.

[00:06:44] Luke Squires: Why do I know that? Because they kept calling up to cancel at the last minute. What that enables us to do is offer products that allow flexible cancellations, for example. But it’s only if we have that consumer insight our business is able to do that. And I think the crossover between your contact center industry and the rest of the business has never been truly slick. And I think now, because we’ve got so much data, we can be an informed voice at that table. And for me, Steve, it all comes down to the data. If you’ve got something to back it up, there’s credibility around what you say. So we play a vital part, and we should be that voice.

[00:07:20] Steve MacDonald: And one part I’d love to get your thoughts on there too is you have sales operations underneath you, you said. But even the regular agents that are just taking questions in, that’s an important part of a cross-sell and upsell strategy that’s a direct line to revenue. Do you have the data, have you tracked the data on that side?

[00:07:41] Luke Squires: Yeah, ancillary sales in any business is a high-profit-making element within our organization. We work directly with owners, so there’s not as much opportunity to add ancillaries, but what’s hard to do is getting them live on the booking. We can inform the business of the types of queries that consumers are getting, for example, flexible cancellation, for example, better insurance policies, for example, is there a chef in the area where I’m staying at? And these things are not things we currently offer, but they’re potentially revenue-generating. Now, without the voice of the agent and giving the agent the voice, how do you impact that? And that’s an excellent opportunity for us all.

[00:08:24] Steve MacDonald: Huge opportunity. Okay, so now I want to go over the second part you introduced, which is the Gen Z shift. We got ourselves trained to think that nobody’s going to want to talk. And once the older generation, that trend, moves on, nobody’s going to want to speak to us on the phone, right? It’s gonna be a tiny part of that. But we’re actually seeing now that the younger generation actually does want to do that. And so tell me a little bit about that shift and how you’re thinking about that in terms of your own internal strategy and what you’re doing as a result?

[00:08:57] Luke Squires: Yeah. I mean, I find it hard to believe, Steve, every time I hear that stuff. I’ve got a 14-year-old son, and I don’t think he’s called me on the phone. He doesn’t know how to make a phone call on the phone, but he certainly knows how to WhatsApp or Snapchat me. But it’s really interesting speaking to other professionals within our industry, where the conversation that this generation is looking for is different to the conversation of the past, but they are wanting a conversation.

[00:09:21] Luke Squires: So when I’ve tried to deep dive into what does this actually mean, because you can easily go, “Oh right, they wanna speak to someone,” or “They want that personalized relationship.” And like we talked to contact centers of old, actually, they want speed, and they want more about speed and resolution.

[00:09:39] Luke Squires: So whichever is the quickest way for them to reach an outcome so they can get on with their day, onto their next thing, that’s what they’re looking for, which is why voice started to rise in that generation. Because actually, sometimes picking up the phone and articulating your query and getting it sorted is the quickest way. But that generation is very much about lifestyle. It’s about enabling them to have the lifestyle they want. They want to be out, going out early one night, so they don’t want to wait for a WhatsApp response. That’s the difference.

And that’s really where I’m starting to think. One of the things I’m thinking about, Steve, is actually using AI voice bots. We have a few prototypes on the go. So they’re talking to someone, but the query’s being handled by AI. And we’re seeing whether or not that fits the expectation. But who knows? We might be being too clever, but it’s exciting.

[00:10:33] Steve MacDonald: That’s one area of balancing transformational tech and service demands, and how the service demands are evolving and changing. The tech is evolving and changing.

[00:10:42] Steve MacDonald: So basically, what I’m taking away from you is, if I balance the tech, if I keep my eye on what my customers want, like the insight you said there, they just want the fastest resolution. They want to get on with their day. So, picking up the phone’s gonna do it, let’s do that. So, that balance, tell me a little bit more about that in terms of what you’re thinking about how you’ll be operating differently a year from now than you are today.

[00:11:10] Luke Squires: Yeah. So when I’m looking down the line, I think 18 months, two years ago, I thought that I would not necessarily have as human-focused a contact center as I probably will have. So I think I was very much going after an automation strategy. And I remain very focused on that because I do think, as an industry, we do have the tools there to be really efficient now, and therefore we can work differently.

I think what I’m starting to do, and again, I go back to data and insights, for me, it’s golden stuff. I’m being very particular over the types of queries that I believe, or the team believes, the data tells us is a basic human right that can be completed in an automated way. For example, someone being able to update their payment details, you should be able to do that in this day and age in an automated way.

So it’s important to me to make sure, yes, I want to have that human element, but I absolutely have got to get the basics. So we’re working through all of those kinds of transactional queries as we speak. And we’re gonna have 60–65% of those queries automated by the end of this year. What that will then enable me to do is have a team of people that are available when we need them available.

[00:12:27] Luke Squires: But clever, and I think this is where the AI comes in as well. So why will I not need to go to the same level of resources I think I would’ve gone to? Because I am going to be using, and I’m using AI quite heavily. After call work, for example, I’ve got automated transcripts. So my team no longer sit there and write loads and loads of notes up after their calls. That enables me to be efficient in my headcount, but also deliver the service that I believe our consumers expect. WhatsApp, SMS, they’re six, seven times more productive than taking a phone call. So how do we push that through and how do we make sure the response times are really effective? And again, for me, the enabler and the thing we’re all really lucky to have is this new AI world. Being able to prompt an agent on a call that you’ve got, being able to prompt the agent on the type of response to give on the call, it’s like it’s a game changer.

[00:13:18] Luke Squires: It’s really exciting, ’cause when I was an agent on the phones, I didn’t have that. So we can really be pushing average handling time, our wrap time, and delivering better than we’ve ever delivered. And it’s just a good time to be in this industry.

[00:13:30] Steve MacDonald: You brought something up there that you talked about, what I thought I was gonna have to have in terms of live workforce a year from now is changing and it’s expanding. But there’s also workforce demographics that are changing as well at the same time. Tell us a little bit about that, because that’s an important part of the equation.

[00:13:48] Luke Squires: I think it goes back to the generation discussion. Our workforces have been heavily millennials over the last number of years and a mature generation as well. We’ve got the Generation Zeds coming through and they expect different, and I’m very challenging of my team in the sense of it’s not for them to adapt to the way that we work.

[00:14:10] Luke Squires: We need to adapt to the way that they want to operate, and that enables us to get the best out of our people. So again, I think we all should hold ourselves to account to be really open-minded to the changes in the workforce. And I’m seeing it quite significantly.

[00:14:24] Luke Squires: I think I’ve never seen a workforce that is more passionate and excited about progressing in their careers, but really quickly. And I think back to when I started out, three years as an agent and then a manager, now, people want to do it within six months, within 12 months.

[00:14:40] Luke Squires: And if they haven’t done that, they’re looking around for the next job. But it’s the change in expectations. So how do we enable ourselves as an industry to support that? And I talk to my team now about our recruitment, and I’m actually far more vocal about the fact that we’re a feeder for a career as an agent, right?

[00:15:01] Luke Squires: We will have some that come in and want to be managers, but actually they want to be marketeers. Or if they want to work in HR, how do we give them a really great grounding within the contact center and the business to enable them to do that? So again, I think it’s really thinking quite differently, because historically we’ve recruited call center agents with call center skills based on wanting them to stay in a call center for a long period of time.

[00:15:27] Luke Squires: And we definitely have to move that mindset away. Otherwise, you’re gonna have a high attrition rate, which I think a lot of us are seeing now anyway at the moment. So how do we stabilize that?

[00:15:37] Steve MacDonald: It’s interesting because the normal thought process is really good training and really good coaching and absolutely giving ’em that career progression. But you’re addressing that right up front, which is incredible. What are agents saying, prospective agents coming in?

[00:15:54] Steve MacDonald: When you talk to them about that, is that one of the most important things as their criteria, whether they want to join the company or not,or how does that play?

[00:16:03] Luke Squires: One of the biggest things that I’m seeing from the team, the colleagues that are joining now, this generation has incredibly high values and has incredibly high morals. They want to work for a business that cares about that. So I’m seeing more and more, you and I talked at the beginning,neurodiversity; they want to work for a business that understands it, that believes in it, and that champions it. They want to work for a business that appreciates diversity and talks about it and does something about it. And I think businesses have absolutely embraced diversity and all sorts over the last few years, but this isn’t about fad, this isn’t about saying it, they want to feel it.

[00:16:44] Luke Squires: And it is a very different way of working. Recently, and I can only talk about my particular situation, but we had Neurodiversity Celebration Week. First time ever as a senior leader have I stood up in front of the business and talked about it from my personal perspective, but I did that because I know that’s what the workforce are looking for.

[00:17:04] Luke Squires: They’re looking for people to lead it within the DNA. Salaries are important, benefits are important, but actually it’s more, it’s about how I feel about the business. Can I connect with the business? Can I connect with the leaders of the business? Do I believe in that business?

[00:17:18] Luke Squires: And if they don’t, they’ll quickly jump off and find somewhere that does. And I believe we’re a big business and I believe passionately that we should be leading that sort of behavior and that sort of change.

[00:17:30] Steve MacDonald: The way I would summarize what you just said is the culture of the company is one of the most important things to attract and retain the right talent in your agent pool. Is that the right takeaway?

[00:17:44] Luke Squires: I think, Steve, that’s a great summary of a long-winded answer.

[00:17:47] Steve MacDonald: It’s interesting because I’ve actually interviewed a Chief People Officer who had his PhD, and he did his thesis on connecting the dots,the data points,to if we have a culture that creates more employee engagement, it will create ultimately more client engagement and more growth for the business.

[00:18:11] Steve MacDonald: So, tying directly the culture of the business to long-term sustainable growth, we all know that’s true, but it seems like, especially in the younger generation, you’re seeing that it’s even more true than ever before.

[00:18:25] Luke Squires: I’m seeing this a lot deeper as well, Steve. It’s a lot deeper engagement and trying to retain your team now. Again, of old, how I would’ve done it previously is make sure we had beer Friday day and that I had pizzas on the go. And we are ringing the bell. Now, I still do all of that because I absolutely love that myself and I get a real energy from that, but I do see it’s deep, it is deeper than that, and it is trust and it is belief in a business that they’re doing the right thing and they’ve got the right organizational values. And yeah, I think that is a significant evolution.

[00:18:57] Steve MacDonald: Absolutely. Now, how do you take a company culture like that, and the importance that you’ve just talked about is a big part of this, is outsourcing partners that are actually part of outside organizations, BPO partners that you’ve hired. Just tell me a little bit about how you leverage outsourcing partners and the importance there, and then let’s dial it back to the company culture that you were just talking about as well.

[00:19:25] Steve MacDonald: Mm-hmm.

[00:19:25] Luke Squires: Outsourcing’s an interesting topic for me. So, it’s not something that we do at Sykes Holiday Cottages. If I think about outsourcing, I think outsourcing has a negative connotation because that’s taking jobs from people that work here and putting it into an outsource provider.

[00:19:39] Luke Squires: Again, I think that has massively evolved, and it is no longer about that. You could still do both and actually get something even better. I guess where I see other colleagues doing outsourcing particularly well is when they’re able to utilize their technologies and get efficiencies from the outsourcers who specialize in that type of work, and complement the operations that you have onshore. And so, I think, yeah, for me it’s an interesting one because it’s not one I’m necessarily deeply passionate about at the moment, but it’s a little bit like AI to me. If you’d asked me 18 months ago about AI, I would’ve said, oh, we’ll see. And now it’s here.

[00:20:20] Luke Squires: It is one that I think I’ve seen some companies doing incredible work with it, having incredible relationships with it as well. I think that’s always the thing, Steve, that’s made me a little bit nervous, that I am a passionate people leader and I like being in control of the culture. And I guess that links to your question. It’s still that culture, and I think it’s something that I’ve not yet got myself comfortable with as a leader. And if I was to ever look at doing something like that, one of my primary focuses would be culture, tech, and then probably the KPI element of BPOs. But yeah, you’ve gotta be in a brave world, I think, to do it. But I see it work.

[00:20:57] Steve MacDonald: One thing you mentioned there is being a leader and culture is one of those things. KPIs, the vision, the company, it all has to come from the leaders. What’s the leadership style in this kind of the modern times that we’re at, right? This transformational change that’s happening in the business. How important is leadership of the company and involved in what you’re doing and creating those customer experiences that you know are gonna make a difference?

[00:21:25] Luke Squires: So, it’s pivotal. I’ve worked for some incredible leaders over my near 20-year career, and I’ve worked for some not incredible leaders, but I’ve learned loads from both. And some of that’s not what to do. But it’s been good time. And I think, for me, leadership in this day and age is probably the most important and the most successful part of what we do.

[00:21:46] Luke Squires: My boss at the moment talks a lot about the transformational change of leadership, and he talks to us around how you can steer a team to success with the same people if you have the right focuses and you are pointing in the right direction. For me, authenticity and empathy, they’re the biggest traits that I look for in a leader and something that I fundamentally really believe in, and transparency. And I think, again, we are living in a world where we should be treating all of our teams like adults. There shouldn’t really be any secrets around what it is we’re doing because the moment we have secrets, you can’t turn that ship.

[00:22:23] Luke Squires: And that honesty is essential. I look at my senior team that work for me, and I hope that they feel empowered to make decisions. I hope that they feel accountable, but equally supported. I don’t run my operation with the iron rod. I’m passionate about KPIs, and when I see them moving, it’s a great place to be.

[00:22:43] Luke Squires: I focus heavily on celebrating successes. Again, I had one boss many years ago say to me, “Luke, it’s much better to catch people in rather than catch ’em out.” So again, I like to focus on the things that go really well and just create that kind of high-performing level five lead leadership environment.

[00:22:59] Steve MacDonald: So here’s my last question. We’ve talked about a lot. Our human brains, we can only remember about two or three things at a time, especially with those of us that have ADHD, right? So, if there was one main takeaway that you wanted the leaders that are watching or listening to this podcast to take away from this today, what would that be?

[00:23:23] Luke Squires: I would say that my biggest takeaway is don’t be naive to the changes that you’re seeing in consumer behavior, colleague behavior, and digital behavior. And unfortunately, I don’t think those three things will line up, but it’s moving at a fast pace. But there are proven sources out there now that we can, for once in our industry, be so much more proactive about the way that we approach it.

[00:23:47] Luke Squires: So, be aware of it, but plan for what’s coming up because it’s exciting, and we can deliver amazing things as an industry if we’re ahead of the game of it.

[00:23:56] Steve MacDonald: Amazing. Thank you so much. Here’s one thing I know is gonna happen. People are gonna have questions, and if they do, is it appropriate that we give out a link to your LinkedIn profile that people can reach out and they can get hold of you?

[00:24:07] Luke Squires: That’d be amazing. Yeah, I’d love to connect with people.

[00:24:09] Steve MacDonald: Fantastic. The goal, the mission of this podcast, is to get different perspectives from different leaders all throughout the industry so we can learn and share. And if we do that, then that’s the rising tide that lifts all boats, and you were a big part of that rising tide today. So, thank you for coming on.

[00:24:28] Luke Squires: No, it’s been amazing. Thanks so much for having me, Steve.